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Marty Stuart's Pilgrimage

Posted February 2020

Marty Stuart David McClister 10 CroppedIf you’re a long-time, baby boomer country music fan or are a younger music aficionado who knows great country music when you hear it, then you are, undoubtedly, more than aware of country legend, Marty Stuart.

Whether it’s through his earliest work as a child musical prodigy with Lester Flatt’s Nashville Grass (appearing with the band on Hee Haw at fourteen years old) as well as his work with Vassar Clements, Doc Watson, and Johnny Cash before launching his solo career.

That career encompasses eighteen solo albums, two live albums, a soundtrack album, a ton of compilation albums, and thirty-three singles. This earned him prominent screen time in last year’s acclaimed PBS Ken Burns documentary, Country Music. He’s been a member of the Grand Ole Opry for twenty-eight years and is a member and past president of the Country Music Foundation. The icing on the cake of his life is his lovely wife of twenty-three years, country star, Connie Smith.

Stuart recently added “author” to his list of achievements, with his book entitled, The Pilgrim: A Wall-to-Wall Odyssey. It’s a phenomenal book inspired by his 1999 album, The Pilgrim, that is chock full of photos reflecting his career and his own amazing photographic work taken while on the road.

To chat about the book, I contacted Marty while he was on his tour bus, headed for a show at Chattanooga’s Walker Theatre.

I started my questioning with a comment as to how the book seems to reflect the depths of his heart and where he currently is in his life and asked if I my perception was correct.

“Absolutely. Because, it was, at the time, it was a bold move. Part of the circumstances forced me to do it. But, you know, when you keep getting away with something that keeps working, whether it's right or wrong, you tend to go with it because it's easy. And that kind of played out. And at the end of the 90s, I was kind of forced to either keep going and become a parody of myself or turn around and go back into my heart and remind myself who and what I really believed in and who I think I was set on earth be. So, that sounds like me, me, me, me, me, but that's where I had to go at that moment. And, so, I think what Scott Somar said in the introduction, this book is absolutely true. There was kind of life before The Pilgrim in life after The Pilgrim.

Because of the depth and intensity, I read and felt from the book, it begged the question: Does Marty have a Pilgrim sequel in the works as a result of all this?

“I don't know that there is a sequel to The Pilgrim. It's one of those movies - it's a standalone thing that I can always refer to. And I'd never - even though there was not a lot of commercial success that went around it at the time, I knew the power inside the record and I knew the heart and the soul and the passion and the tears that went into making The Pilgrim and living through it. And I knew that it would come back around. But it was not one of those things where I go, 'I'm going to do The Pilgrim Part Two.' It just didn't work that way. It was too organic to work that way.

“What happened right after The Pilgrim was kind of a good indication because after The Pilgrim, everything kind of fell apart. I came up out of the ashes and put the Fabulous Superlatives together. And, so, we decided to take one more run at country radio and we made a double-minded record. It was on Columbia Records. It was called Country Music. Half the record was reaching for that parade that I was kind of trying to be a part of it. And the other side was reaching toward the heart and soul of the matter. It was a double-minded record. Some songs were really good. And I knew that I had to get on one side of the line or the other after that record.”

Continuing his reflection, Marty shared:

“I was in New York City and I walked into Bleecker Bob's bookstore on Bleecker, the Bleecker Box. There was an Ella Fitzgerald box set. Beautiful! It was linen-covered - lavender-colored with linen fabric and embossed with silver. It just said, ‘Ella Fitzgerald - The Verve Years.’ I bought it just because it was pretty. I didn't buy it for what was in it. But when I opened the box when I got back to Tennessee, there they were: all of Ella Fitzgerald's recordings from the Verve label. It was eleven things, Porgy and Bess. Ella sings with Louis Armstrong. Ella does this. Ella does that. Here's the Christmas record.

“I thought, 'Wow! Right there is how a musical life should- might ought to be lived.' And I have always remembered that box set that I still have. And whether it was The Pilgrim and after The Pilgrim, I don't think there has been any missteps there. You know, there came Soul's Chapel, then Badlands, Live at the Ryman, Way Out West, Compadres. It's all been meaningful stuff that I could listen to without coughin' at any point. But it was still The Pilgrim that lit the fuse on that and became a way of life after The Pilgrim.”

I asked Stuart to share what the book itself is all about.

Marty Stuart David McClister 10“Well, The Pilgrim, as far as who I am, I don't know. If you're a mandolin player, I'm a mandolin player. I'm a guitar player. But I think what I have become without trying is just - I’ve lived long enough that I think I'm one of the touchstone figures of the culture of country music. I think I'm one of the go-to people for the world of authentic country music. I'll buy that. I can back that up. And The Pilgrim was a record that happened in 1999, 20 years ago. That was a return after a long commercial voyage - an incredible run - back to the heart and soul, to the bedrock, the timeless place, to a timeless place in country music. Authenticity. As every evolving artist reaching for his roots and his true self, the authentic self buried within, I suppose. There was a lot of heartbreak and disappointment when the record didn't work. But, you know, the lesson in it for all of us is sometimes you have to wait around for things. So, my friend Tom Allen said in this book, I think he said sometimes paintings don't sell the first go ‘round. Monet, whoever. So, this is a painting that didn't quite sell the first go ‘round, but it comes back 20 years later. It teaches us all that authenticity and the real stuff that comes from the heart usually finds its mark however long it takes one. Is that good enough?


I thought the cover had a bit of a Stevie Ray Vaughan vibe going on with it. I asked Stuart if that was intentional or just him being him.

“Aw, that's just me wearing black clothes. And, you know, it looked a whole lot more Edwardian than Stevie Ray Vaughan to me, at the time. You know, The Pilgrim was this character that I had to makeup; a black hat; I don't know why I thought of a cape. But a lonesome character making his way through the world, you know, covering up his pain and misery.”

What section or chapter of The Pilgrim would Marty point to as a calling card for the entire book?

“Well, you know, I know that there's a true book buried inside me somewhere and I keep puttin' out books with a whole lot of pictures so I don't have to sit down and write the book. For a true music fan, the photographs alone in this book are, alone - out of the archives - are worth the price of admission. But as far as the story goes, I think you could look at Billy Bob Thornton's intro or what Johnny Cash advised me to do after the record failed; or you could look at the first chapter that talks about Memphis and what it was all about. Perhaps that would do it. Or, if you're a guitar collector, just the guitars there in the back of the book that we used on the record is pretty cool.

The book includes a re-mastered copy of its CD namesake. Why?

“I think that music was the entire story was - I think I alluded to in the book - in my mind, it started out as just one - a big ol' song, but it turned into a bit of a Shakespearean opera. And my friend, Jack Clement, though, great old record producer made a comment one day. He said, 'I promise you that Shakespeare would have been a great George Jones fan.' Ha! Ha! That kinda took me to a place like this. It's kind of a tragedy, a classical tragedy, in a sense. It needed voices along the way, in my opinion, to move the story forward. So, I just got my phone book and called my friends. And they came by EmmyLou and George Jones and Connie Smith and Johnny Cash and Pam Tillis, Ralph Stanley, Earl Scruggs. They all came by to help me get the project taken care of.

About the current state of country music, I asked Marty if he felt that the business was broken and, if so, (and if he was made “country music czar”), what would he do to fix it.

“Is it broken? No. It's doing the same thing it did in 1930. I read a review somewhere along the way from the mid-thirties, once upon a time, in a trade magazine about a Bill Monroe record that had just come out and he had taken a Jimmie Rodgers song and sped it up to a breakneck tempo. He sang in a high voice. And I think that review went something like what is this: ‘Is country music crashing? Is hillbilly music crashing and burning?’

“Now, this man has taken a sacred Jimmie Rodgers song and singing in the voice of a woman, playing at a breakneck L R Jerry Lee Lewis Carl Perkins Marty Stuart Johnny Cash and Roy Orbison ReducedL-R: Jerry Lee Lewis Carl Perkins Marty Johnny Cash and Roy Orbison Photo Courtesy of Marty Stuart

tempo that no one can listen to, you know? So, the question of what's happening to country music goes back that far. Old-Time fiddle bands thought it went to hell when they brought drums to the Grand Ole Opry and Ernest Tubb brought in an electric guitar. So, you know, that's the deal. We all have our points in which we think it's authentic and that speaks to us. So, if you look at the modern chart, I think it's doing the same thing now that's been spoken all along.

“It's a little bit more unrecognizable now because it's a little more homogenized if not a whole lot more homogenized than I think it's ever been. If I were the czar, I would probably just say take it back to the original blueprint to where you go to the Bristol sessions. The Bristol sessions had gospel music; it had fiddle things and they had your bawdy tunes and they had the Carter family. They had a little bit of everything. And I think that's what country music - the world of country music - still is. The beauty of it is now, it's big enough that whatever you truly believe in, as far as the music goes, there is a space for you. I think if you if you just look at the CMA Awards and what happens at CMAFest; and if that's what country music is to you, you're just getting started because there's a vast world that goes beyond that. I wish we could level it out for the masses where everybody had a bit more voice. So, that’s what I would do is level it out.

Congress of Country Music LogoClick Above To Donate To The Congress of Country Music!Fans know that Marty hosted The Marty Stuart Show on cable TV’s RFD-TV. The channel still runs the re-runs but I wanted to know if there are any plans for new episodes of the TV show.

“Different TV show. We did 156 episodes of that particular one and called it ‘Mission Accomplished’. I’m working on this cultural center down in Mississippi, the Congress of Country Music. It's my hillbilly presidential library. So, if you're going to be in the backwoods of any state, you must broadcast. We're working on a TV show right now. That will be based around the artifacts and the collection and tell and go from there. Cool stories. Yeah.”

A reader submitted a couple of questions. One of them asked what Marty would’ve done had he not pursued his career in country music and is there anyone Stuart’s wanted to work with that he hasn’t, yet.

His answer to the first question: “Either with my own florist or in jail. I don't know, man! I could have had a photography studio. But I'm glad country-music was there.”

As for the second question, Marty answered: “Well, I've worked with pretty much everybody I ever wanted to. But there's an artist that I've never met and I really admire the quality of her work and the quality of her voice. That's Norah Jones. And, so, I just think Nora's a real artist for real.”

As a prolific musician and accomplished guitarist, I wondered if there were any guitars that he considered to be the Holy Grail of guitars.

“Well, concerning country music, there's two. One is Mother Maybelle Carter's guitar, which is in the process jewels exhibit at the Country Music Hall of Fame. And the other one is Jimmie Rodgers guitar that hangs in a vault in Meridian, Mississippi at the Jimmie Rodgers Museum. Concerning country music in my mind, there's those two guitars. Then there's everything else.”

Wrapping up our chat, I asked the country music legend how he wanted to be remembered and what he hopes his legacy will be.

“Well, I think I think the truest thing I could say to you is that he finally found something that he believed in with all of his heart and, then, he followed his heart at any cost to get the job done without compromise. And I hope I could be true to that.”

That he has, is, and will, no doubt, continue to be.

Order Marty’s book, The Pilgrim: A Wall-to-Wall Odyssey, by clicking on the widget to the left side. Or, order it while keeping up with Stuart's latest goings-on by visiting

The Side Deal Becoming The Real Deal

Posted February 2020

The Side Deal 002If one hears the phrase, “side deal”, it can conjure up different images. It could mean stepping aside formal, “main” deal negotiations to craft an alternative deal (as is often the case in politics). It could mean a relationship “on the side”.

In the case of Charlie Colin (formerly of Train), Stan Frazier (Sugar Ray), and brothers, Joel and Scott Owen (PawnShop Kings), their “side deal” was a fun little band they’d put together amongst themselves to play the occasional gig while not working with their aforementioned respective main bands.

The four have known each other for many years so getting together for those occasional gigs was an easy no brainer. Add to that mix the encouragement and participation of the legendary Rock ‘n Roll Hall of Fame inductee, Jeff “Skunk” Baxter (of Doobie Brothers and Steely Dan fame), viola! A great side deal became a great main deal named, well, The Side Deal.

I was recently offered the phenomenal opportunity to chat with all four of the band members shortly after their arrival at the Sundance Film Festival. After they were settled into their hotel rooms, they called me to chat about the band and its forthcoming CD. Before the call, I was given a copy of one of the songs, “Ghost”, from that album. Phenomenal. Absolutely amazing. Stay tuned for that one!

After introductions were made and some small talk shared, we got down to business by asking Joel and Scott Owen about at least some of their past having been somewhat rooted in my home state of Tennessee. Joel answered.

“We grew up in Orange County. We all grew up in the same hometown of Newport Beach. However, my brother and I have a lot of roots through Memphis. So, we spent our whole life coming to Tennessee. Our mom grew up in Memphis. Our grandpa was a farmer just over the bridge in Arkansas. Once we started playing music, Nashville became like a kind of a second home to us there for a few years.”

I just had to ask what the whole story was behind the band’s name. Charlie Colin responded by saying, “Well, I think it's safe to say that all of us had spent a lot of time with our respective bands prior to this and everybody was immersed in a number of projects. And so, what happened is we all grew up in Southern California. We all moved away and had careers and lives and we all seemed to move back and we got reconnected. That kind of was a really cool coincidence.

“We were asked to do things because we have people who knew our old songs . . . and Train and all the songs were hits. And so, we were asked to do some charity shows and stuff. So, we kind of got together to do these things once in a while. And the thing was, it was magic. And I think it's also safe to say that all of us know that bands are . . . there's a true cliché, but there's so much sacrifice involved and they can be painful, like any great family or anything that's valuable.

“I don't think any of us were like, ‘Yeah, let's start a band, all of a sudden!’, you know? But then it became to where I know, for me, after we played a show or two, it was just a fallout; it would be almost like a depression afterward because we just got along so well; the way we sang together was something I hadn't experienced and it seemed that we would instantly connect with these audiences where it wouldn't just be a cool event. It would be like people would say, ‘Hey, that was surprisingly meaningful!’ And I was like, ‘Yeah, me too!’ We felt the same way. I know at one point - I mean, I know we all thought this, but at one point I said, ‘I think we have to, unfortunately; we have to organize this. We have to make this a band. I think I have to - I want to do this.’ And so, we did it basically because, when I went to sleep at night, I thought, ‘If I don't do this, I'm going to regret it.’ And so, we took the plunge.”

Joel then chimed in.

“The real big losers in that was, of course, was our wives. They're, like, (mimicking a voice dripping with sarcasm), 'Awesome.'

“Then, the genesis of the name that happened actually was kind of an ironic story, because each one of us, I think at different times in our previous bands, had some kind of funny business with somebody in the previous band doing some kind of shady operating at some point.” Stan Frazier added:

“We commonly referred to it as a ‘side deal’. We bonded over that like, you know, 'You experienced that, too? Oh, my gosh! Your manager stole from you and your bandmates were not above the board? Wow! That's weird!'

“So, we were just we're toying around with a few names, but we were calling it just ‘Side Deal’ in the beginning. And then a friend of ours said, ‘You should call it, The Side Deal. It sounds a little more like it's a thing.’ That's the whole reason behind the name: The Side Deal. So, there you have it.”

The SIde Deal 001(L-R) Scott Owen, Charlie Colin, Stan Frazier, and Joel OwenColin then concluded by saying, “We also have a lot of friends - because we've all toured for years and years and years - and so we have friends in other great bands that we actually really love and admire and, so, a lot of guys started sitting in here with us. We had side guys popping in and out. It was kind of a revolving door of talent coming through it. So, we were kind of like this for sure - the core of the band - but we have friends that when we're in certain towns, they're sitting with us.

“One of the producers that we work with is Jerry Harrison. He was the guitarist and keyboardist in the Talking Heads. And he wrote ‘’Roadrunner with Lou Reed and White Light Way and whatever. And, so, he will come. And when we record him, if we have a show coming up around that time, he'll sit in with us and then we'll play some of his songs.

“At a Side Deal show, you can see us playing some old Train; some old Sugar Ray stuff; some old talking head stuff. But it’s someone on the stage who wrote the song. So that's why it's not cheesy.

“Also, we had other things on the side, too. And then this became for me - I was, like, ‘Well, this is actually my main thing.’ It's funny, this is The Side Deal. Now it's like what I want to do with all my time.

As I mentioned earlier, I heard the band’s song, Ghost. I love it. When I asked what the story was behind the song, Scott was the one who spoke up.

“Hey, man, we're Southern California raised. All of us love the ocean and it’s super inspirational. At this point in our lives, any time we can get out there and surf, we're gonna do it. I was out surfing one day and got an idea for a riff and got the ideas for the beginning of the lyrics and it started to come pretty quick. I jumped out of the water and raced back to my car to try to get my phone before I forgot it. I sent a really rudimentary version of it to Charlie and he heard it and flipped. So, we all started to develop the song. It was our first kind of like - I mean, we had written a couple of songs together as a band, but that was the first one that we took to the finish line and it ended up being the one that everybody responded to the most, whether it be live or recording or whatever. So that's the first one we released. We're really excited about it. It's been really cool. The writing process has been collaborative because we all tend to really bring a strength that is unique and specific out of the four of us. We kind of look to each other to round out the edges of the songs. It's really a pretty unique experience for us as collaborators.”

Charlie added: You know, Scott and Joel. started - amongst other projects they started the Pawnshop Kings and made a bunch of great recordings with that band. I heard that and I was floored. And then also, Stan is the drummer and also plays guitar and, I think it's safe to say, the main hook writer and the guy of Sugar Ray. So, it's a really eclectic band. I love it.

“When Scott wrote that riff - I just want to say it's funny because I called him (and said), ‘Man. It feels like you wrote that about and for me.’ And I said, ‘But I know you didn't.’ I mean, I know what's going on and I think everybody's going to feel like that. I think that the cool thing about the writing in this band is that we're at this spot in our lives where we're writing about real motifs. And even though the songs are like a blast, I was put in this great mood, but we're talking about addiction and lost friendship and then redemption and loyalty, which is, you know, tough stuff. And, then like stuff like 'we used to party like it would last'. It was because Grandmaster Flash and we're thinking about Soft White Lines in that way. And, so, then when it goes into stuff like that. Where I'm in recovery, it's stuff like that really means something to me. So, we do touch upon these heavy subjects and some of that's intentional. But it's kind of cool to be in a role where people can put themselves in these songs, even though it's just wonderful to listen to it. You know, it gets my heart beating. there's some depth to that.”

It goes without saying that there's going to be comparisons to all the guys’ other bands and their musical past. I asked what The Side Deal 003their thoughts were in response to that. Frazier answered first.

“You know, it's funny. I was expecting a lot more of that at this stage of the game. But, personally, I really haven't gotten a lot of comparisons. I think what we're doing is – we were talking about it on the way up here in the car. It's like we're still developing our sound and we're trying to figure it out. I mean, we're a vocal-based band for sure with a lot of roots and different sorts of genres. But I feel like I haven't got one, 'Hey, that sounds like Sugar Ray!' Not one! And I definitely think that's a positive thing in a lot of ways because we're really trying to do our own thing here. That stuff might creep in in some places, but I'm sure I haven't heard any of the comparisons, which is refreshing to me.”

Joel added, “One thing I have heard people say is they go, 'Whoa, Train and Sugar Ray and Pawnshop Kings. Like, what the heck is that going to sound like?' And we say, 'Modern-day Eagles.' But then we all come in the same way. We have these strengths in writing. We have these strengths of playing and sonic sensibilities. And as Stan just mentioned, we're still figuring out what it does sound like. But it has been so exciting to hear these things come out because I think about, personally, I think about Train, Sugar Ray, and Pawnshop Kings - what the heck is this going to sound like? Charlie talks about the motifs, the themes were singing about. There's a depth to the music and the melodies that we're writing. And it's, for us, it's just really overwhelming to kind of watch this thing and feel this thing and experience this thing take shape.”

Hearing the guys talk, I thought that it all sounded as though their musical collaboration is a much more fluid and natural process than they might have experienced in the past. I asked if my perceptions were accurate. Joel answered first, comically:

“I'll say, for me, personally. I've just been writing with only my brother for a long time, so there's nothing fluid about that.”

Colin then added: “There were a couple of good years out of the fifteen that I was with my old band. I mean, those couple of years were really happy, but I was going to say, like, when it was really working and the original band was together, I was like aware of something. And I remember that. I haven't thought that since with these guys. Scott started coming over to my house sometimes before we actually needed a band and we had so much material that it was ridiculous. And then, every time we had a practice, we would write two or three ideas that I thought were better than the ones we had before. I thought, ‘You know, it felt so natural that I didn't want to overreact. But it's like, that's magic. It doesn't happen forever. I think this band is so prolific, it's ridiculous. But I also thought, if that's happening, let's take advantage of it because who knows how long that will be? But it seems to just be getting started.”

I then asked if it is a lot different recording as The Side Deal compared to recording with their previous bands. Scott led off with the answer.

“I would say we're more excited about this than we have than about anything that we can really remember. And I think the recording process often falls in line with that. I mean, Stan has produced quite a bit. We've all made a lot of records. So, at this point, it's exciting to be in the studio together because I feel like, for the most part, that fluid nature that we kind of collaborate within the genesis of the songs happens in the studio as well, because we continue to, basically, come up with ideas that we unanimously enjoy. And then it's a matter of choosing the one that we think is the best. It’s not, 'No, not yours, mine this time' or whatever. It's pretty unique. I've never experienced anything like it.” Then, he jokingly added, ‘I mean, to Joel's point, it's just been him and me, it's really hard...”

Charlie then added, "It’s just that this is one of the things I know that maybe this is unique, here. Maybe it isn't. But at this point in our careers, we all play - like sometimes we'll write on different instruments. Live, we kind of figure out a way that we play certain things, that we have consistency there. But in the studio, it's like we're passing guitars around. Somebody will jump, you know, Scott will play the piano but Joel came up with it. It's like it doesn't really matter. And it's like I've never had - it's not that nobody cares because I used to be so concerned about my parts. But, like, we joke around and I'll look at Scott and I'll go, 'We're a great guitar player', because, between the two of us, we'll work on a part for a little while and come up with something that we wouldn't have come up with alone. And that's, like, cheesy. It sounds corny because it's so nice. That just doesn't happen.

“I remember my other band, there's an inherent kind of, let's say, that is so, you know, counterproductive and unnecessary. At this point, there's just absolutely none of that . . . as long as these guys know that I'm the boss. Ha! Ha!”

With all this phenomenal camaraderie that is fostering amazing songwriting collaboration, I had to ask when The Side Deal’s debut album will be coming out. Scott said:

“The record is due to come out in the spring. We're finishing up the songs and we want them all to be at the same caliber. We want everything we put out to be excellent. Different producers, different situations that we've already found ourselves in, that we're realizing different strengths come out. We have an intrinsic kind of unanimous vote. Like, when it happens, we all know it. That's what we're going to fully put the music out. But there is a tentative plan to put it out in the late spring.”

What else on the band’s radar for the next year or two? Stan said:

“You know, all the things that we do leading up until that, we're getting ready to do some corporate shows and we've got a few like hometown gigs kind of in the works. But we plan to get out there and we'd like to do some opening slots for some bigger acts to get in front of some real eyeballs. And so, yeah, we're putting the team together with a booking agent and we just got a manager and a business manager. There's no real need to rush that stuff until we get to a body of work finished to where we feel like it's worthy to listen to. So, the next couple of months are really big for us.”

Colin then added: As I mentioned before, we're working on the record, we had little pockets of regions where we had a demand so we would play shows there and they would sell out and we did great. We felt like it was time to take it to that next level.

“But one other thing that I wanted to mention is that we really do have some really interesting people involved. And I was thinking because you said yours is a boomer magazine that, for example, an old friend of mine - and now he's kind of a part of this band - is Skunk Baxter. We do a song fairly well with him. We flew to Washington, did some shows with him. He comes in town, sits in with us. We get to do his Steely Dan stuff. I've known him since I was a 19-year old. He, basically, got my first band signed. He was like a mentor. At the same time, we're surrounding ourselves with kind of these people that have - I don't know, there's no way they can teach us what they know unless we just do it with them.”

Clearly, The Side Deal is poised to be a big deal in the music business. Join me in following them at their website,, where you can also connect with them on social media.

Kalie Shorr - An Open Book

Posted January 2020


Kalie Shorr Open Book Album cover croppedI’m the father of a beautiful, thirty-five-year-old daughter. She has had to endure a lot of things in her life. Those trials have made her strong and smart. So, when I hear of someone her age or younger prevailing over the ugly hand life deals them, I take special notice.

Such is the case with an exciting, new, up-and-coming country artist, Kalie Shorr. Die-hard country music fans have likely heard of her. For those of you who haven’t, I’ll tell you a little bit about this remarkable, new country artist.

Kalie is a tough girl with a sweet voice and strong work ethic who took the rocky road to country stardom. Born and raised in Portland, Maine, Shorr moved to Nashville as a teenager, working at a hot dog stand as she set her eyes on country music stardom.

Self-taught on guitar, she played in bands in Portland, playing Nirvana and Pink Floyd tunes while her real passion was country music. Driven to pursue her passion, she took extra classes so she could graduate from high school early. She also worked two jobs so she could raise the money to finance her move to Music City, which she did by the time she was 19.

She teamed up with a couple of other young women who wrote songs and, together, they wrote an anthem – a battle cry for young women – titled, “Fight Like A Girl” and independently released it four years ago. It received excellent buzz and airplay on digital radio. She was also named a “Highway Find” on SiriusXM’s The Highway channel as well as was part of CMT’s “Artist Discovery” program.

In 2017, a second single, “He’s Just Not That Into You” as well as her next EP, Slingshot, garnered a ton of incredibly positive press from the likes of CMT, Whiskey Riff, Country Music Chat, Morning Hangover, Sounds Like Nashville, Taste of Country’s “2017’s Hottest Artists Under 25”, and Rolling Stone Country’s “Artist You Need To Know”.

As the old Ronco commercials used to say: But wait! There’s more!

In this past year, Kalie was named a “Top 10 Country Artists to Watch In 2018” by the Huffington Post and a CMT Next Women of Country. Additionally, Shorr released her last EP, Awake, to even more positive buzz as well as toured with Sara Evans and RaeLynn on the CMT Next Women of Country Tour.

Early last year, Kalie fulfilled a life-long dream when she made her Grand Ole Opry debut. She called it “one of the most emotional experiences of my life” and has since gone on to play the Opry many times. Late in the year, she headlined the Walmart/Pepsi “Road to the CMA Awards” Tour as well as launched a daily radio series called “Let the Girls Play” hosted by Kalie and fellow Song Suffragette Savannah Keyes, on Radio Disney Country.

Through her lyrics and onstage banter with her audience, Kalie’s message of female empowerment has led to praise for her social advocacy from NPR Radio and let to features on PBS NewsHour, NPR’s “Morning Edition” and “On Point” in addition to ELLE Magazine. Open Book is Kalie’s first full-fledged CD that came out in September about which Rolling Stone Magazine said that it “showcases the alchemy that Shorr concocts…which manage[s] to conjure both Shania Twain, Red-era Taylor Swift, Dashboard Confessional, and Alanis Morissette all at once.”

As a father, all of this hit me where I love to be hit. I knew that I had to talk to her to hear more so I reached out to her while she was on the road. After introductions and small talk, Kalie shared with me her story about her new album.

1 KalieShorr CatherinePowell ReducedPhoto by Catherine Powell“The album is my first ever full-length album. I wrote every song on there and I co-produced eleven out of the 13 songs with my producer, Skip Black. I'd been working towards an album ever since I released my last EP in January of 2018 called, 'Awake', and I had the vision to potentially start doing a full-length album. I thought I knew where it was headed. Then I got hit back-to-back-to-back-to-back with some of the hardest things I've ever gone through. It was all in a one-year period I went through. I had to deal with losing friendships and all that. Then, also, six months later, my sister passed away from a drug overdose.

“It was just like stuff all at once. It sent me catapulting back to how I wrote when I first fell in love with songs, which was we me sitting on my bedroom floor, processing the world around me by making it rhyme. And I kind of I stopped writing for any purpose other than myself and working through it. That really birthed these incredibly vulnerable songs. It's a level of vulnerability and emotional exposure that I never thought I would do. But it happened and releasing it out into the world and having it be received well has been the best experience. It's just so nice to know that you can you can bear that much of your soul and strangers will like be kind to you about it; find some sort of common thread and that we're not all so different after all.”

Regarding the new album, I asked Shorr if there was a particular song that she would point to as a calling card, so to speak, for the entire album.

“Well, I think that the lone of my favorites on there is, probably, 'Gatsby' or 'Vices' because I think that they like have a level of . . . . they're both songs where I'm admitting that I am part of the problem, too. Like when you're going through something really tough, it's up to you to not make it harder on yourself. I really like that perspective because the album, as much as it's about like a really painful period in my life, it's not a ‘let's play the victim’ all the time on the record. I really didn't want to do that.

“But I think, as far as a song that encapsulates the record, it would be, 'Too Much to Say'. I put that as the first track on there. Probably about an hour into writing the song - I was writing it with two really talented writers in Nashville and we were working on it - and I realized, ‘Oh, I think this is the first track on the album.’ And I thought 'Too Much to Say' was a great way to start. It's like, ‘Hey, buddy, you're in for quite the ride.’ And the first line of the song is, ‘I've never been worse. Thanks for asking.’ It does really encapsulates the whole record. It's almost like a laundry list. It checks out all of the different things you're going to hear on the record; the different stories that really give you like a peek into what you're getting. And, so, I kind of started calling it the thesis statement for the album.

When I asked if writing and performing the songs heals more than it hurts, Kalie replied:

“Yeah, I absolutely think so. I would say the two hardest songs to write were 'Escape' and 'The World Keeps Spinning'. But 2 KalieShorr CatherinePowell ReducedPhoto by Catherine Powellafter I wrote them, it felt like a weight was lifted off my chest. And now performing them every night, even though it's hard to go back and think about those stories, I'm hearing from people in the audience who relate to them. I've been on tour with LeAnn Rimes. We just finished our Christmas tour and I've been playing, ‘The World Keeps Spinning’. Even though it's a really sad song about the day I found out my sister passed away, I think that it's the story that has kept me playing it because. Christmas, in particular, there's so many emotions surrounding it. And if you've lost somebody or even gone through something as simple as a breakup, it's so bittersweet because the holidays are so fun and beautiful and sparkly and you want to celebrate. But it's also a reminder of everything that happened that year and everything you've lost and what your expectations were. Holidays that might not have actually come to fruition.

Does Kalie hear stories about how the songs relate to some of her fans?

“Yeah. I mean, people have already gotten lyrics the week that it came out. A girl got a ‘World Keeps Spinning’ tattoo and another girl got ‘Too Much to Say’. Really interesting because the songs that were the hardest for me to write, they're the ones that have been resonating with people for them to want to put the lyrics on their bodies for their whole life. I think a story that's really resonated with me is I really talk really openly about my family on the album. It's not always positive because nobody is always positive. I mean, I'm sure we all dealt with things in a way we're not proud of. I cover that and talk about how it's affected me as a person - especially in 'Escape'. My siblings all heard the record and they have found so much comfort in it because it's all things they've experienced, too. Like, ‘The World Keeps Spinning’ - having that song written and it's exactly from their point of view. It is really interesting to see how much comfort they've been able to find in it. Even though it's really raw and not always pretty, they've been so supportive. I think that they needed these songs as much as a stranger would need them. Even more.”

In listening to Kalie talk, I couldn’t help but ask her if she felt that there’s an invisible hand guiding her along.

“Yeah, I really do. I'm a very, very spiritual person and I do a lot of prayer and meditation when preparing to do this record. I also have gotten a lot closer to my family after my sister passed away because it really made me rethink my priorities. I go home ten times as much now. I think that God and my family - and even my fans - gosh, they pulled me through so much when things are really tough. And the thing about my sister passing away, it made it even harder, which I didn't know anything could make it harder, but it's tougher. I'm just successful enough as a musician to make a headline when something like that happens and that was so difficult. So, everybody knew and my family and I had to talk about it like, ‘OK, well, how are we going to handle this now that it's out? What do we do?’ And we're like, ‘Well, we're just going to own it and be honest about how she passed away and not try to cover it up and make it pretty. Because that doesn't help anybody. And drug addiction, that's a problem right now. So, let's be open about it.’

“I think that being able to hear - when . . . I first talked about it on Twitter in the days after it happened, after the article came out, I was like, ‘Hey, yeah, my sister passed away and blah blah blah blah blah’. And I got so many responses from fans. Hearing from my fans - how many people shared that common tragedy made me feel so much less alone on something that has that much stigma on it.

What has been the biggest surprise to Ms. Shorr so far since began pursuing her career in country music?

Kalie Shorr Open Book Album cover reduced“Well, I mean, I think a real rude awakening I had when I moved to Nashville was that I moved to Nashville at a time when women weren't getting played on the radio, and they still aren't. But the problem with starting right when I moved to town, I thought because all I was listening to was Carrie Underwood and Miranda Lambert and Taylor Swift. I didn't know that the radio didn't play - I moved to town and women were making up less than 10 percent of country radio. Then, once people started noticing, they were like, ‘Oh, my God.’ And then I was like, ‘I love being a woman and I love being a woman in Country and now it's like a strike against me.’ There are times I went into record labels and I'd have them say, 'Sorry, we can't sign you because we can't sign another girl right now.' It's unreal. And I'm just like, 'What? This sounds fake.' Unfortunately, it still happens. It doesn't slow me down or stop me at all. But that was definitely a surprise to move to town and be like, ‘I'm going to be a female country singer and then have Nashville be like, 'Ummmm no.’”

Because Kalie is mature well beyond her years, I asked her the question I typically ask legacy artists: How do you want to be remembered and what do you hope your legacy will be?

“I mean, I think that I'm very proud of the person I am at twenty-five and I try to always have the perspective as I am. I think that the term role model is a little bit convoluted these days because it's like it's not about being a teenage pageant princess. It's not about never drinking tequila or, you know, saying gosh darn instead of damn. It's about being someone who is strong and set the standard for themselves and achieve that and treat people kindly, but also to let people walk all over them.

“And so, when it comes to being a role model, I try to think about how would an eleven, twelve, thirteen-year-old Kalie, dreaming of moving to Nashville, how would she think of me and this decision I make? And it's almost like I'm trying to be a role model for my past self. And, you know, I have nieces and nephews, so that factors in.

“But I think that I just try to always have that perspective. I'm like, ‘Okay, where I'm at right now and the decisions I'm making, would little me be proud?’ And so, I think that it's just staying true to that because, like as a child, that's the core of who you are. That's like your purest part and that's the part of you that's just all light and all love and directly from God and everything else is just the world, making everything blurry.

“But if I stay true to that, that light in me, then I think that I'll live a life that I'm proud of. But I think that, for me, that's just continuing to be honest with my music. I care about my fans so much. I mean - and especially putting out a record like this one - it gets really personal at the meet and greet lines and it's something I have had to prepare myself for. Because if I'm going to play a song like, The World Keeps Spinning, I'm probably going to hear a very tragic story from someone at the end of the night.

“I just recently I had a woman tell me about how her mother had committed suicide when she was 21 and she found her and that was something I had to be prepared to hear. But all you can do in that moment is just recognize how similar we all are, like I said, and just hug her and just try to give as much love as I can to this person that I don't know in a really small interaction. But I think stuff like that makes such a big difference. And I just want to keep treating people like that. “LeAnn Rimes says a quote on stage every night. We been joined together and it really stuck with me. It says, ‘Love is making loving choices in fearless moments.’ I really love that. I think, even just showing love at any chance I get is a really, really long way of saying that simple thing.”

As for what is on Ms. Shorr’s radar for the next year or two, she said:

“Well, touring. Lots of touring. I'm excited because the album has been out for three months and that's been exciting. But all the year-end lists that we've been getting on The New York Times said it was the number seven best album of the year. It was, like, in the real New York Times that I can hold in my hands, which is crazy! Things like that, those bring my album to a whole new audience. I got on so many 'best of' lists and I just was not seeing it coming. It just totally baffled me. So that is definitely creating a lot of different opportunities that I wouldn't have had two weeks ago.

“There's a lot more cool stuff coming but, definitely, I'm going to be playing the album top to bottom and re-imagining some of my older songs and taking that on the road. And then, you know, we have another music video that will be out at some point in the beginning of the year. I'm just really excited to keep both of those moving.”

And moving she is and Boomerocity will continue to track her progress in the male-dominated Country music business and look forward to watching her star rise ever higher. You can do the same thing, in part, by connecting with her website,

Phil Madeira Speaks His Mind With An Open Heart

Posted February 2020


PhilMadeira 76 cropPhoto by Stacie HuckebaAbout six lifetimes ago (the late seventies), as my interest in contemporary Christian music (CCM) continued to mushroom, the Phil Keaggy band put out their debut (and sole) album, Emerging. I bought the album as soon as it hit the shelves of the now-long-defunct store, Christian Discount, in Phoenix, Arizona.

In addition to Keaggy’s always amazing guitar work, I couldn’t help but be equally intrigued by the keyboard work on the album. Reading the liner notes (remember how much fun that was back in the glory days of vinyl?), I saw that the maestro on the keys was another genius named Phil. Phil Madeira. He was (and is) to the keyboards as Keaggy is to the guitar.

While the PKB was a short-lived project, Madeira’s career wasn’t – and isn’t.

Since those days, the Providence (or close to it), Rhode Island, native has become a prolific solo artist in his own right as well as contributing his brilliant musicianship to a head-spinningly (yes, that’s a word. I just made it up because we needed it) long list of other artists – and not just in CCM. No, far from it. That list includes Amy Grant, Charlie Peacock, Kenny Marks, Vanessa Williams, Buddy Miller, Little Big Town, The Waterboys, Emmylou Harris (more about Emmylou in a moment) and others. In other words: Phil Madeira is a trusted and reliable go-to, multi-talented musician that some of the top names in the music business.

Phil has also been prolific in his composition work for such artists as Alison Krauss, Toby Keith, Garth Brooks, Keb’ Mo’, The Civil Wars, again, many others.

He’s played a festival or two in Newport. The folk festival . . . and the jazz festival. Pretty freakin’ cool. He’s a recipient of a Dove Award, an ASCAP Humanitarian Award, and an inductee into the Rhode Island Music Hall of Fame.

When Madeira isn’t creating his music or lending a musical hand to his many friends in Nashville, he is an integral part of Emmylou Harris’ band, The Red Dirt Boys, and has been since 2008.

All of these accomplishments made Madeira one of the prominent names under the broad umbrella of the always-growing Americana genre. I had connected with Phil via Facebook but we hadn’t really communicated other than an informal “howdy” once friend requests were sent and accepted. It wasn’t until a personal introduction via Phil Keaggy, that Madeira and I chatted up about getting together for an interview.

Madeira invited me to his place for the chat. He was immediately gracious and accommodating as a host. From the git-go, we slid into chatting about all sorts of stuff unrelated to the purpose of my visit (talking about his new CD, Open Heart). I’m pretty sure that, in the midst of all discussed, we solved world hunger but I have no proof of that.

Settling into the reason for our interview, Madeira started by commenting on the state of contemporary Christian music and how, for someone who was somewhat involved in it back in the ’70s and ’80s, he’s not so much any longer.

“ . . . because I just don't know who's out there anymore. . . . I think the Christian music scene is shrinking. I'm grateful that I'm very much a believer, but I'm also grateful that I was never really allowed ‘in’ as an artist in that world. The doors that kept opening for me were doors of service, songwriting for others and playing for others.

“A problem I have with Christian music is this: does art have to constantly talk about its source? For me, it doesn't. I'm going to have a much more interesting conversation with another person if it's not just about what I think. And, so it is musically. The Christian music world was so limited musically and lyrically - the door was never open for me as an artist. We're talking 35 years ago.”

Pointing over my shoulder at some wall art, Phil continued.

“Honestly, musically, if you just look over you over there - when you see Thelonious Monk and Ry Cooter, the Beatles- that’s what I love to listen to. The only gospel music I listen to is Mahalia Jackson or something like that.”

Then, circling back to the CCM world, Madeira said:

PhilMadeira 1Photo by Stacie Huckeba“And I don't know how many people in that world go home and listen to the music from their own world. The artists that I think are amazing from that world aren’t really shining there any longer- Cindy Morgan, Nichole Nordeman, Lost Dogs, etc”

Phil leaned in.

“You know it’s funny how many artists who had great gigs found God and then were convinced that somehow the Christian market was where they needed to be. Rick Cua, Joe English- Joe English with Paul McCartney! BJ Thomas. Thank God Dylan didn’t bite that hook! Isn’t it ironic that you’re called to ‘go into all the world and preach the gospel’, but you get sucked into this insular world that doesn’t really get outside of itself and preach to the choir?

"My trajectory was the reverse, as has been the case for a few friends who started in CCM- Gordon Kennedy, Wayne Kirkpatrick, etc. The irony for me is that I followed my heart, followed my dreams. I basically said yes to most of what has come my way. And I'm fine with that. I've played with every session player I've dreamt of playing back in the 70s, I have played with them all. Russ Kunkel, Lee Sklar or Al Perkins. That, to me, is God up to something, you know.

“I’ve made my Mercyland: Hymns For The Rest Of Us” projects as a gentle proclamation of belief and inclusivity, but as for my solo records, I’ve made that statement. Until I change that statement, it still stands. I prefer to write about the journey from here on out. My Providence record- there's a teeny bit in there. But, it's just about growing up in the north and feeling the pull of southern music; eventually winding up here.

“Open Heart”, the new record - it comes out of a place of grief that I wasn't even acknowledging. It's about romantic love andPhilMadeira 5Photo by Stacie Huckeba loss- the ups and the downs of love. And all this comes from a heart that is trying to live in harmony with its creator. I’m broken, I’m joyous, I’ve won, I’ve failed, and I’m still moving.”

As our chat progressed, we talked about how life’s trials prune us and what we thought we knew and believed.

“I think failure can do that. I remember when I went through my divorce. I have two grown daughters. They weren't grown when we went through a divorce, though. Thankfully, their mom and I negotiated that stuff well enough that fifteen, sixteen years after the divorce, we were good friends. You know, I love her. We care about each other. Our kids don't freeze when we're in the same room. We have a very extraordinary divorce, I think. There was no scandal, but when it went down, I took a lot of grief from a lot of people. I still have at least one person out there who hates me because I left, and she’s happy to tell folks that I’m a loser.”

Phil smiles and says, “She’s absolutely right”.

“When we divorced, I was really afraid of God abandoning me. I go to an Episcopal Church and they have a little prayer service, very early. I was there every day and that, honestly - the process of failure made me a more tender person. I'm a more forgiving person because I have much to be forgiven for. Because of this, I'm probably more embracing of whatever comes my way in terms of the difficulties I've had. When people hate you or accuse you, lashing back isn’t going to improve your lot. It’s in those places of feeling the wrath of other humans that you can find God. God’s been through the same thing, only more so.

“But, all that to say is that the good times give you good times. The bad times actually give you character if you know how to embrace them. The bad times teach you about God and teach you about yourself. Bad times generally are the things that produce good art. And so, I'm grateful. Anything you know - my state of mind is essentially one of gratitude. “I know that I don't live the sort of Christian life that my mom would have wanted me to live. I'm a profane individual. I'm very liberal, politically; very liberal theologically, except that I really do dial into the story of the risen Jesus. I don't see Jesus as symbolic. I see Jesus as Jesus. Jesus welcomes all. ‘You're gay? Come to church.’ I can’t get lost in the arguments that Evangelicals want to churn up. I want to make music and love people.

“I'm sixty-seven. I should be done by now, but I guess I’m a late bloomer. I've never been more prolific. Up until recently, I've stayed out of the spotlight. It's always been about serving - whether it's been Phil Keaggy or Emmylou Harris or go down the long list. Right now, it's just I have that opportunity to say, ‘Well, I'll invest in what I'm doing’, and I've been doing that for about three years. I played the Newport Jazz Festival last year. The residual for me is the music itself. . Relationally, the guys in Emmylou's band are my closest friends. They're, bar none, it's the best band I've ever played with. I mean, it's insanely good.

PhilMadeira 76Photo by Stacie Huckeba“If you see Emmylou Harris with her Red Dirt Boys, that's us. We have the incomparable guitarist Will Kimbrough bringing his special sauce. Brian Owings on drums; Chris Donohue on bass- both of whom are on my new record, Open Heart, and on my Providence record. I built those records around that trio- the three of us. Bass and drums and yours truly on piano and vocals, recorded live and then we started adding stuff. As Red Dirt Boys, Will Kimbrough is our guitar player and, in Red Dirt, I play guitar as well, but I fell back on the keyboards a few years ago. I do love that.

“n terms of band ego versus an individual ego, I've never experienced anything like Red Dirt Boys. When we jam, Will Kimbrough and I will take off; we’ll solo at the same time. It’s like Little Feat, like New Orleans Dixieland, but with guitars. We both sing. We both play. We pass the lead vocal back and forth with Chris and Bryan holding down the groove. It's remarkable. It's not my band. It's as much the drummer's band as it is anybody else's. That's a sweet thing. The spotlight shines on all of us as one”.

“The Keaggy Band days were all about Phil and he was gracious enough to share that spotlight with me each night, but it was his music primarily. The weird cult-like church we were a part took most of the money, and so our bonds were formed in some ways because of our struggle to survive. Lynn Nichols said to me a few years ago, ‘Why didn’t we just up and leave the church, and put some money in the bank?’ Well, we were superstitious; our concept of God wasn’t just about Him loving us. It was also one that was a bit afraid of Him. Our scene was all about staying in line and obeying our ‘elders’, who were all about 32 years old! Crazy. It’s a miracle I believe in anything after all that. But I do.”

“Playing with Phil was an exceptional musical experience because we liked to make up stuff as we went along. It was part of our sense of Spirit, quite honestly. And everyone was on board, all the players. We were just kids, 22, 23 years old except our drummer who was a decade ahead of us; the old man in the band. But we took chances musically, which was a real rarity in Christian music. We were sort of like the Grateful Dead but lacking in great material. As much as people love “Emerging”, our one disc, the writing on it is not amazing, not Phil’s, not mine. The backdrop of being controlled by a religious community lurked in the way we operated, and I think that maybe the reason that there will never be a reunion by the original PKB. But it’s funny how often people ask some of us, ‘When will you guys unite and make another record?’ Well, never say never, but never.”

I then asked Madeira to tell me about his latest CD, Open Heart.

“Open Heart. Basically, what had happened was my partner passed away in 2017 of cancer. She found out around Christmas PhilMadeira 84Photo by Stacie Huckeba2016. Man, it was a terrible time and I was not allowed to speak of it. She had her own little community, but I was forbidden to have mine. Of course, I resented it. I just felt pushed out. I had my daughters and two friends as the support system.

“Eventually, a few months before she passed, I just said, 'I can't do this anymore. I love you. I'll do whatever you need me to do. But in terms of being this guy that you keep rejecting, I can't do this. We've gotta figure out a new way.' That turned into a terrible rumor that I left her because of her cancer, which was devastating to have out there, but it was out there. She had convinced me that she had another ten years of life, and I knew we couldn’t continue in the paradigm of behavior that we’d created.

“And then four months later, she just took a dive for the worse. I saw her one time before she passed away. She passed away eight weeks after I last saw her. She just lived half a mile from here and I wasn’t really given the opportunity to grieve or to be part of her departure. That one little lie- ‘he left because she had cancer’- effectively destroyed me within the community she and I had shared for years.

“During that terrible season of rejection and being scapegoated I wrote six tunes were rootsy and jazzy, upbeat and bitter. It's very almost like 50s, 60s jazz with vocals - like Horace Silver meets Mose Allison type lyrics. Cutting. Bitter. Which was the way I dealt with this barrier to finding closure. Primarily, they weren't directed at her, they were directed at the people who ran with her story.

“Now I realize that I was in the anger stages of grief..

“Meanwhile, she passes away. I'm in the back row at the funeral. The priest at the funeral stared at me when she put the wafer in my hands. It is weird to be hated. I never lashed out. I don't think my non-lashing was motivated by goodness. I think I was just smart enough to know that it was just going to bring more shit on me if I did that, right? I had my daughters as my support system, which was sweet, but also terrible. They shouldn't have had to experience that. They saw me at my most dejected.

PhilMadeira 96 1Photo by Stacie Huckeba“So, she dies. And, then, about four months later, I started seeing someone. I was foolish enough to think, ‘Well, I guess, you know, she made things so difficult for me that I guess she made it easier for me to move on.’ Which was dead wrong but it's what I thought. I started dating this gal and she was going through her own terrible breakup and rejection. We were rescuing each other, which- trust me- rarely works out. I started writing these tunes that became the record that's coming out in February called Open Heart. But what I realize now is that, especially in the songs that are addressing this woman's grief, I'm actually addressing my own devastation.

“The first line of this album is 'You're going to grieve it for a long, long time, your open heart was the scene of the crime, you keep asking me questions. Why, why? Why? Baby, your guess is as good as mine.'

“It took me a long time to get to the point of celebrating this woman I’d given a decade to, despite the bad ending. I loved her then, and I love her still. I miss her, sure. Her ending was terrible, and leading up to writing ‘Open Heart’, I was in denial about my grief. I was dismissive of those beautiful years, because of the hurt her ending heaped upon me. But once I realized what really created Open Heart (my grief), I was able to remember what I loved, long after the photos were tossed out, long after I thought I’d never think of her sweetly again. And now, a picture will show up on social media- the two of us loving each other somewhere caught in time, and I’ll save it and savor it.”

Phil then asks himself out loud before continuing: “What's the last verse? 'You kneel on the tombstone of what seemed meant to be. Sometimes the prayers is a rosary bead. in the grotto of dashed hope and sacred memory, whisper a prayer for your beautiful dream.'

“My heart was addressing itself, even though I didn’t know it. Isn’t that beautiful? And isn’t that how God works? Subtly and sacredly.

“There's a lot of humor in the record and there's some sadness. But I call it Open Heart because that's me. When it comes to my heart in a relationship, I open it right up. I'm looking for that intimacy that I had to a real sweet degree with the woman who passed out. That's what Open Heart is trying to talk about. Meanwhile, there's this crazy back story of grief and the journey, but I still smile.

“I’ve got my basic go-to team on the record- Cindy Morgan. She's a frequent partner of mine in terms of duets. John Painter
on Horns and James Hollihan on guitars. It’s my standard crew. I love the people I work with. I’m blessed.”

Drawing those comments to a close, Phil concluded, “To me, I'm interested in real life. You know, I'm not interested in knowing how good you're doing with God. I'm actually interested in how bad you're doing with God. That's much more intriguing to me!”

“I gotta believe that God's mercy is good enough to know all of the mistakes I'm making about Him. I'm just saying I don't know everything. I tend to be pretty dismissive of a lot of stuff that I grew up thinking was true. But now, I don't worry if my kids are not on the same page as me with spiritual things. I'm not freaking out over that. Whereas my mother took it personally if I didn’t see God the way she saw him, I am content to believe that my kids are on their own unique beautiful journeys, and God is with them. I am not looking to see myself in the mirror of my children's eyes. I want them to be who they are. I trust that God is good and that whatever path they're on, whether He's visible, whether God is visible to me or to them on that path, I’ve got to believe God is on their path. It might look like a path to destruction. It might look terrible. But everything that you know seems to point that way, even in Scripture. Like in the Psalms, where it's saying, ‘I go all the way down to hell, I can go all the way up to heaven, You're there.’ So why would I think, Well, yeah, He's everywhere except on that path of someone I don't understand. I don't worry about it. I don't worry about hell.”

“What I hope the rest of my life looks like is: making great music, traveling, playing, producing and continuing on in the joyful journey God has me on- life's too short to make stuff that doesn't matter.”

Keep up with Phil’s work and appearance itinerary by visiting

Phil Keaggy On Faith, Family, Life, Love, and Music

Posted January 2020

Phil and FedoraBack in the seventies, Contemporary Christian Music (“CCM”) was humming right along. It’s what helped keep teenagers at the time (like me) interested in church and its music. People and bands like Larry Norman, Love Song, Andre Crouch, and many others were among the pioneers and torchbearers of the genre. 

In that mix of pioneers was a brother/sisters trio called 2nd Chapter of Acts. They were amongst the real rockers of the genre. So, in the summer of ’77, when I saw that they were coming to the Civic Auditorium in downtown Phoenix, I immediately bought tickets. Sure, I noticed that the tickets said, “2nd Chapter of Acts, Phil Keaggy, and a Band Called David” but I was going to see “Acts”.

Let me just say that, while I’m still a big fan of 2nd Chapter of Acts, I went into that concert an Acts fan and came out being a huge Phil Keaggy fan and am one to this very day. I’ve caught him in concert a variety of times over the past 43 years and own a large percentage of his recorded work (though I recently learned that I have some serious catching up to do!).

That was the summer of 1977. Fast forward to October of last year.

I attended a house concert that was a fundraiser for a worthy cause. Phil Keaggy was the featured guest. I hadn’t seen him in concert for quite a long time so I was looking forward to the show. After it was over, I approached him and introduced myself and indicated that we both had a mutual friend, Ken Mansfield, who was over the U.S. arm of The Beatles  Apple Records and has worked with countless other iconic artists over the years. Phil and Ken are close friends and Ken had this to say about Phil:

"Well, I've known Phil for quite a while and too. I always say, to know Phil is to love him and he's probably the most gracious, kind person. And so childlike in how he treats other people; the simplicity and his ‘straight-aheadness’ with you. So. Oh, yes. And then you stick inside that wonderful thing, the ability to be the greatest guitar player in the world. It's just a real wonderful package there in one place. So, I've known Phil for a long time and I think it's probably the most exciting KEN AND PHIL ReducedKen Mansfield & Phil Keaggy - Photo by Brian Mason

Courtesy of Ken Mansfieldrelationship that I've had. - both as being in the music business but also just meeting a brother that I can really count on and trust and love on."

When I asked Ken what is the least understood thing about Keaggy, he laughed and replied:

"Wow. Now let's try and find something to say that's not great about Phil. That's harder than saying something that's great about him. I don't know. He has just - I think his child likeness just makes him so innocent and kind and gracious all the time that, I would say, the only thing for him, like anybody else, is being in a business that gets a lot of people, as we say, in their face a lot. Sometimes he may have to be a little guarded because he is so kind and gentle, people do take advantage of him. And, you know, there is a plane to get to and there is somebody who has been on the road for twelve hours, then playing for three hours and then has to get back to a hotel so they can get two hours of sleep. It's hard for people to understand that sometimes. So but even in that, he is always gracious in letting you know he can't really do something for you at the time."

Back to Phil and the house concert, when I left that evening, Phil was kind enough to agree with me that an interview was in order. 

In the past, I’d briefly met Phil, snagging an autograph on a couple of the albums. He was always gracious to me and anyone else he was approached by. I’ve watched him deal with over-zealous fans as well as over-zealous Christians. I’ve watched him perform with amazing, talented artists such as Rick Derringer, Greg Martin, and others and I’ve watched him share the unknown audience members – talented as well as the “wishful” (that’s the category I’m in but I stay in the audience!). To each and every one, he was far more patient than I likely would’ve been in the same situations. To say that the man has a warm, kind, gentle, gracious spirit about him would be a gross understatement. His heart is truly golden and only possibly exceeded by his gift of playing guitar.

The guitar. That instrument attempted by many and mastered by relatively few. For those who have watched Phil play, we walk away wishing that we could play his mistakes. He’s a guitarists’ guitarist who is highly respected both within CCM but probably more so in a variety of other genres. He even got to play with Sir Paul McCartney, informally and just the two of them. More about that later in this story.

Back to our interview.

I called Phil at his home in the greater Nashville area. After some introductory small talk, it was HE who started asking ME questions (there’s that graciousness of his, again). With that done, he brought me up to speed on what he’s been up to.

“I've been an indie artist now for about 18 years, since the last record label I belonged to was - or I was signed to was Word Records. They let me go in 2002 and since then, everything I've been putting out has been just indie. That means no marketing or distribution. Very little radio. But I keep working because that's my job and I still do concerts because a number of people still like to hear me play and sing and do my songs. So, the thing is, I keep creating and I've been doing a lot of collaboration, especially over the last - I'll say ten, twelve years with other writers and artists, musicians.

“So, I have a continual flow of stuff that's available to people who know how to get a hold of it. Say for instance on my web site,, there is on the menu - there's a tag called, ‘Keaggy's Garage’. So, there's there is stuff up there that's a lot of live recordings; a lot of demos; a lot of releases that have been indie, my indie releases; a lot of collaborations with other musicians. In fact, just yesterday morning, a jam album - the title of the album is called, ‘An American Garage Band’. It's with drummer Bobby Blazier and bassist Gary Lunn. It's an instrumental and it's all free flow. That's really recent. 

Phil and Les Paul 2 reduced“Another recent project that I did was collaborated with Rex Paul, an album called, ‘Illumination’ that came out last spring. It's a vocal gospel rock album and it has eleven songs on it. Four of those songs are old songs from the 70s and 80s; remakes of tunes like, ‘Time’, ‘Let Everything Else Go’, ‘Spend My Life With You’, and ‘Full Circle’. Rex produced it and he just kind of brought it to a really more of a real rockin', up-to-date, progressive rock kind of feel. He's an amazing producer and musician. In fact, he's the band. He's the bass player, the drummer, the keyboard player and guitarist, vocalist BGV's (background vocals). We wrote lyrics together for the new songs and he just brought some new life - injected new life into the old songs. A lot of folks have found it to be a really enjoyable album. 

“I've done three albums with keyboardist Jeff Johnson. They're just beautiful instrumental works, like soundtrack music. It's just music you can listen to and relax to, chill to, and enjoy the melodies and the textures, because he plays beautiful keys. He's a kind of a minimalist. I provide a lot of the ear candy, you could say, with various guitars like classical guitar, electric guitar, acoustic guitar, 12-string, mandolin, cümbüş - a Turkish instrument. I do all the bass work as well. So, those are three albums I did with Jeff Johnson I'm quite proud of. 

“I also did an album with veteran world class musicians, Tony Levin and drummer Jerry Marotta; Tony playing bass; Jerry playing drums and percussion. It's called, ‘The Bucket List’ and that came out last year, too.”

Then, as if he’s come to the realization at the same time he was sharing with me, he said: 

“So, actually, I had three albums come out in 2019 and they're on Spotify, iTunes, my Web site, Jeff's Web site. Tony's, Jerry's; you can see them in all those different places.”'

Then, turning a little more serious, Phil shared some of his feelings about the CCM industry.

“The industry has changed. We don't have CD stores like we used to. We don't have record stores except for specialty shops, you could say, where you can find LPs. So, when I do concerts, I make my music available to people at the concerts.”

Shifting back to works released, Keaggy added:

“I don't know if you've heard of the ‘All at Once’ album that was recorded four years ago. That's a collaboration, as well, with Phil and his Stratabout 10 different writers, at least 10. There's Lionel Cartwright. There's Nathan Chapman, Ashley Cleveland, my son, Ian Keaggy, who is also a very talented musician, producer, and writer - veteran book writer, Ken Mansfield, who worked for the Beatles. Ken is a wonderful guy. He's still around and I'm grateful for that because he's eighty-two or eighty-three by this time. He's got quite a story. Great testimony.

“Katie Peltier, who's a worship leader, worship writer. In fact, the All at Once album - we had a number of those manufactured and they're out. I'm going to have a minimum - a limited release of the same album, but it's going to be called, ‘Fearless Love’, which is one of the songs on the album, and I'm taking four of the pop songs off and just have it more gospel centered; more R&B blues, where the message is really more clear because that's really what the album was intended to be initially. We all got excited about all these extra songs, but they really didn't seem to coexist that well together. You know what I'm telling you? I mean, the Beatles could get away with it. They'd have. 'I Will' on one album, in the same album they'd have Ringo's 'Don't Pass Me' or, ‘Octopus's Garden’, ‘Oh, Darling’, you know, very different kind of songs. But I just feel that in some sense, less is more. A 10-song project, even though it's a four-year-old album, I feel that it's got some new fresh life.

“There's a song on there called, ‘Breathe on US’, which Katie Peltier sent me her lyrics and her melody. I created the music for it and produced it. On the original album, 'All at Once', those who have that album, it's just basically a bit of an ending with solos going on. In other words, I saved it up at the end of the song for the last two and a half minutes. The solos at the end, because my daughter Olivia, when she heard it, she said, 'Oh, Pops, you've got to put this on your new album because the guitar solos are so sweet.' What I ended up doing was taking her entire song and, instead of it being a lyrical album vocally, it's a guitar - like a Jeff Beck melody to her melody and it really ended up being the longest tune on the album, the ninth of the ten tracks. It's not out yet, but it's going to come out and I really feel it's special. The album ends with a hymn, 'I Must Tell Jesus', which was inspired to record because of a friend of mine who passed away, James Ryle, who was a great Bible teacher, and I helped him make an album in the last year of his life, actually; an album of his original songs and a couple of hymns.”

As the old Ronco commercials used to say: But wait! There’s more!

“So, let's see what else is going on. I did a couple Ambient albums that I released this year by me and Tony Gerber. One is called, ‘Red Lunar’, which is a live, impromptu thing. He plays keyboards and flutes and I play the guitars. It was all live and it was recorded during the red moon when one of the red moon's had taken place. And then another one I did on his podcast with him and a cellist. It's called Pristine Chapel. 

“These are all new projects. So, as you can see, most of them are instrumental at this point. But I do have vocal songs kind of on the back burner. In the can, as it were, just waiting for the right time and place to release those. Like I said earlier, we have limited distribution. We have limited quantity in terms of actual projects that you can actually hold in your hand. Most of it is livestreaming these days.”

Phil and Les PaulTo that point, I surmised that he was benefiting financially from the technological advances in music recording and delivery.

“Oh, absolutely! You know, for the last 25 years, I've been, for the most part, engineering my own music and producing it in my little music room down below. And yes, the cost - it's very cost effective. For instance, the album I did with Jeff Johnson, he has his home studio up in Washington State. He would send me files and I would send him files and he'd mix it. We never paid for studio time. It was just my Pro Tools and his Logic programs and it works really well. 

“But the thing is, like I said, there's not the marketing and there's not the distribution and the A&R departments and everything. There are not the advances there used to be. But that's okay. It's the concerts that help me pay the bills. But to be free and to be creative is a real blessing at this time in my life. I really do prefer home recording and coming up with new music and sounds and to continue to try to grow on my guitar as a guitarist. So, obviously, the main thing is to, lyrically, when I do music that is lyrical, somewhere and somehow it continues to lift up the name of Jesus so that people know the Good News; that there is hope and that God loves us and cares for us all. And so that's the most important thing.”

As I alluded to a few paragraphs ago, I have seen Phil perform with a variety of very talented artists and his albums reflect much more of the same. So, I was curious if there was anyone he would like to perform or work with, musically, whom he hasn’t done so, already.

“I don't know, I don't seem to have a whole lot of ambition in terms of, like, ‘Oh, I wish I could play with this person.’ I don't really have that, you know. I mean, I have deep respect for a lot of the people that have influenced me; the great artists that I grew up listening to. But we're all kind of elderly, in a sense. I mean, I can tell you I'm in my late 60s. I'll be sixty-nine in March and I've had great opportunities over my lifetime to play with people I really admire. Say, for instance, Tony Levin and Jerry Marotta. Those two guys - to be on the same album with guys that played with Peter Gabriel and McCartney and Lennon and all these all these amazing musicians and all these amazing artists. I mean, the list is endless. With who these fellows have played with and here's this little guy from Youngstown, Ohio; and I mean ‘little’. I mean, both Tony and Jerry are
Sir Paul McCartney and PhilSir Paul McCartney and Phil - Courtesy of Phil Keaggyleast six foot three and here I am, a little five-foot four guy. But we got along just beautifully in the studio, created some really fun music. But I did get a chance to play at Linda McCartney sister's wedding back in 1990. As a result of that, I had a chance to just sit down and play guitars with Paul McCartney for about 20 minutes.”

I excitedly interrupted him on that one. Why? Well, my closest and dearest friend knew one of Phil’s brothers. That brother knew that Roderick was a fan of Phil’s and gave him a photo of Phil and McCartney playing together at that wedding. I’d seen the photo back in the early 90’s before the internet was dominant and before that picture and many others were scattered all over the ether. It’s an amazing photo that you can see here.

When I asked Keaggy if he’s had any other interaction with Sir Paul, his characteristic humility showed itself, again, in his reply.

“Oh, no, no. I'm just a drop in the bucket, just one little fella that, in a moment in time, had a chance to shake his hand and pass on to him a guitar that a friend of mine had made. It was a left-handed guitar – a left-handed acoustic guitar - and asked me if I would see if I could put it in Paul's hands. I said, ‘I'll try’. As a result of presenting him with this gift, he asked me, ‘Where's yours?’ And I said, 'Oh, it's over there.' 'Get it out.' And then we just sat down and picked on a few of his tunes, not my tunes.

“He didn't know my songs, of course. Although, I did sing three songs in the wedding and one instrumental. He was very encouraging, you know, like a big brother, like a producer would say (sliding into a British accent), 'You did a fine job. You have a nice voice. Remind me a bit of James Taylor.'

“I mean, he was a great influence on me from a melodic standpoint, a tonal standpoint, vocally. One of the great, great writers and artists of all time, of course, and it was an honor to meet him. I was it was kind of surreal, actually. 

Then, circling back to finish his answer to my question:

“No, we've not. It's not the kind of thing where he would ring me up and say, ‘Hey, Phil, how are you doing?’ But it was nice. It was a nice meeting. It was a nice occasion. And of course, Linda's sister, Laura, (the one who) got married. She's a believer and a really nice person. Both she and her husband have been friends all these years. We've gone to Italy where they live; visited them when I was doing concerts over there some years ago - many years ago. 

“So, anyway, that's one of the stories I wouldn't have ever presumed or assumed or imagined in my wildest dreams that I'd be in the studio with someone like McCartney or Clapton or any of those kinds of players that were influential; you know, Jeff Beck, on and on and on. But I have played for Rick Derringer on one of his tracks, on  Airborne Ranger with the guitarist from Grand Funk, Mark Farner. I have played on a few projects by other people. Greg Martin (of the Kentucky Headhunters) is a great guy. Great guitar player, fun guy. 

Later in our conversation on some other subjects, Keaggy added: 

“I enjoyed meeting Mickey (Dolenz). I played on six of his twelve songs on his album called, Remember. I've been to his house Phil Keaggy at 15 02Phil Keaggy In His Teens Courtesy of Phil Keaggyout in California. We had a listening party with a lot of friends and artists that you would recognize that were there. One of my favorite solos I've ever done on anyone's album was on his album - on the Nilsson song called, Remember - the title song. You should check that out sometime - on Spotify, iTunes. Yeah. Micky - he's fun. A talented guy. For his age, the guy's singing is still great.

“I got to play James Burton and I got to play right next to him onstage, Johnny B Goode and Louisiana some years ago. That was that was a blast for me because I loved watching him play guitar on there. You know, the Ricky Nelson/Ozzie and Harriet Show. Of course, Elvis and Scotty Moore and James were early influences in my life, too. As a guitar player.”

“But, you know, I've had a bit of - I'm kind of an underground musician, and that's okay. I'm a little lower profile than most guitarists, except perhaps maybe in the area of Christian music. But then there are so many wonderful, talented musicians and writers. What really mainly excites me is just knowing that I have a loving family and that's where I get most of my joy from. My wife loves me, my kids love me, love both of us. It's a whole different level of feeling satisfied and complete and music fits in there somewhere. But it's not it's not the whole story for me.”

As I stated earlier, I became aware of Phil Keaggy back in 1977. CCM hadn’t yet reached the stratospheric levels of popularity that it eventually would. It was also a much different kind of business and genre, then. Honestly, for me, it’s a genre that has left me and many of my friends far behind. 

To that point, I asked Phil for his view of CCM today; if it is broke and, if so, what would he do to fix it.

“I really don't keep up with it very much anymore. I continue to read my Bible and pray and share my story when I do my concerts in many cases, many times. But as far as the business, I don't have much connection to it anymore, so I can't really tell you. I know that there's a real emphasis on worship music these days, and I certainly will support that. But I think one of the things the record labels - Christian record labels and radio -  they really didn't know what to do with musicians like myself, in a sense, because, you know, half of what I've done through my lifetime is instrumental work and there's not much of a room and a place for that. But it's important to me as a musician to let my voice be heard through my guitar, not just my vocal cords. I think I'm probably more known as a guitarist than a singer or a writer and I get that. 

“I've never had a real true pop sense. I think the only song I had that went to number one for a couple of weeks was a tune I
didn't write and that was 'True Believers'. Alan Shacklock, a British musician, producer and writer - he wrote that song and Glass Harp 1972Glass Harp 1972 - Phil, John Sferra, & Dan Pecchio  Courtesy of Phil Keaggythat was about it. There's one station up in Pennsylvania called, WJTL, who's been very supportive, even though I've been kind of like in the background; sort of - well, I don't know how to put it - diminished in popularity, in a sense, because in the 70s, 80s and the early 90s, I was a bit on the radio, you know. But, not since really. Ninety-eight was about the last time. But that didn't cause me to quit. I mean, I don't do it because of radio. I don't do it because of sales. I do it because I love music and I really enjoy other musicians. And the process of creating and, you know, making music with others, it's really been very important to me.

“So, I really can't. I can't really give you - put my thumb on the pulse of the music business at all. I have no idea what's going on, really.”

I shifted gears in my questioning. I perceived Phil as being one who uses what he has and acquires only what he will use, guitar and gear-wise. With that in mind, I asked him how many guitars he had, figuring it would only be a handful.

“The guitars I own are the ones I use, so I don't have that many. I have a dozen guitars or so and that's it; guitars that I've had over the years, for some of them, 40 years or 30 years. I've got a Les Paul, a Strat; a Zion and a Yamaha and a couple basses that I like to use - a fretless and a Gibson bass, a Hoffner bass. I've got a 12 string. They're all instruments that I've utilized and used in the studio. So, no, I don't have a truck load. I have what I use. They're my tools. I'm not a collector. I'm not in the business of buying and displaying, you know. I just don't do that. I just use what I have and that's it. So, no.”

Phil’s wife, Bernadette, wrote a book several years ago that deals with the subject of the heartache of miscarriage at birth. I brought up the book and relayed that I had told a young couple I had went to church with at the time about it as they had experienced the tragedy of miscarriage several times like the Keaggy’s had. 

“Oh, it was! It was a tough time in our young lives, to lose babies. We lost triplets the first time at five and a half months and a baby boy another year later who lived three days at six and a half months along. Then, a miscarriage a year after that. We didn't know that we'd ever have any kids. But then we moved to Kansas City in 1979 and 1980, Alicia was born. Thanks to friends who are very supportive and a great doctor who just happened to be a godsend to both Bernadette and me. 

“And so, in the early 90s, Bernadette wrote the book, A Deeper Shade of Grace, and it was then rereleased under the title of, Bernadette Phils Wedding DayBernadette & Phil's Wedding Day - Courtesy of Phil KeaggyLosing You Too Soon. It has been a blessing to a lot of people. It will never be a top seller because not everybody has that story and that experience. But there are many who do, but they just don't know about it, you know. But it has touched a lot of people and I'm glad that Bernadette wrote those chapters with her own hand and it's her own voice. She speaks for both of us. And I’m happy to tell you that we became, for the first time in September, grandparents! Our daughter, Olivia, had a baby boy and we are just over the moon about him. He's beautiful and a fantastic little kid, you know?

Of their son, Ian, Keaggy said: 

“We worked on that together. There was even a Glass Harp song on an album we did called, Hourglass. It's the funest song on the album. It’s called, Weather Boy. It was Ian's first lyric that he wrote when he was about, oh, 13. I put it I put it to music. It's called Weather Boy. It's like the Who. You could probably hear that on Spotify. I think Hourglass is up there on Spotify. But yeah, he's working with a lot of professional people and writers today. He's really articulate, very intelligent and kindhearted, gifted young man, really proud of him.

“So, there you have it. Well, it really, really is a real healing that took place. We had our two daughters and a son. They're all in their 30s and they are wonderful kids, wonderful. My son is a very good songwriter and producer.”
With our time to chat drawing to a close, I asked Phil the question I have asked scores of other artists, especially those who are within our age span: How does he hope to be remembered and what does he hope his legacy is?

“Well, that I left some hope into the world. Some joy with my music and that, perhaps, I might be remembered as a kind Phil and Acousticperson. You know, simple stuff like that. Nothing profound.

“We all have a chance to leave a mark, leave something behind worth remembering. Those are the things that matter to me. You know, the fruit of the spirit stuff: Love and joy and peace. I want to be a peacemaker.

“I've got friends that I've had since the 60s that I keep in touch with. You know, that that kind of thing. We’re all family. And my friends from Glass Harp, the band I started in ‘68. I left in ‘72 to work with other people and to do my own music. But we still are close, close friends and we play off and on together still after all these years. In fact, this year, twenty, twenty earmarks, 50 years since our first album came out, half a century ago. The gospel was on that first album. Also coming next month, it'll be 50 years since I gave my heart to Jesus and asked Him to come into my life.

“I think that's the thing that influences me the most, is the Good News of the gospel. I feel the gospel - it's still the best news, especially in the times we live in today. When you look at the Gospel of John and how Jesus taught us how to treat one another, He gives us the grace to do that; enables us and I just think He's not only the greatest savior, but He's a great model, a great example of how we should love one another.”

Phil Head ShotI’m sure that, as I have for almost forty-three years, you will love Phil Keaggy’s work, talent, story, and heart. He truly is the real deal. Please follow him at his website (here), Facebook (here), and Twitter (here).

While you’re at his website, please do check out his store (here) as well as Keaggy’s Garage (here). 

If you were to ask me what to buy (assuming you don’t already own some of his work), I would have a very hard time answering. He’s done so much great work.  From the “Store”, I would suggest, perhaps, his concert DVD, “Philly Live”. “The Master and the Musician” is a must-have, if it’s in stock. If it’s not, then get “The Master and the Musician 30 Years Later Tour” DVD. “Dream Again” is great. The song, “Why” features Ian Keaggy on vocals and is my favorite tune on the album. 

From “Keaggy’s Garage”, I will admit that there is a lot that I don’t have from there (but I will!). I know that “Acoustic Sketches” is phenomenal as is “Premium Jams Vol. 1 and Vol. 2” and “220”. Also, “Jammed”, “Beyond Nature”, “The Wind and the Wheat”, “Roundabout”, and “Freehand: Acoustic Sketches II”. 

See what I mean? It’s just too hard to pick. But once you do, you’ll want everything he’s ever done.

That’s how it was for me forty-three years ago this summer. But I was lucky. He only had two solo albums at that time.